Escaping the 9 to 5 with Julia Jerg

digital nomad mum Julia Jerg

In this month’s interview, I speak to Julia Jerg, who left her corporate marketing career to initially freelance and now run her own business as a ‘digital nomad mom’.

Digital nomad mom

Julia Jerg is the founder and chief editor of JeyJetter.com, a family-travel and digital nomad blog for aspiring nomads and families. She is also a social media marketing coach, public speaker, author, course creator and blogger from Germany. In 2011 she quit her job, sold all of her belongings, bought a one-way ticket, and turned into a successful digital nomad. Since then, she has travelled, lived, and worked remotely in over 80 countries. Before founding Jey Jetter, Julia was the head of a communication agency department in Germany, where she managed a team of editors, graphic designers, and photographers. Her main focus consisted of strengthening the connection between the clients’ needs and her team’s creative approach. Today, she helps entrepreneurs reach their ideal customers on Facebook by applying all her knowledge and experience from over a decade’s worth of marketing gigs.

You can connect with Julia on her website, Facebook, Instagram and on Clubhouse: @juliajerg

Anna:               Okay, hello everybody. Welcome to this month’s interview. I’m here with Julia Jerg, who’s coming to us all the way from Thailand. So it’s just past bedtime for her kids over there, and it’s bright and sunny here in London. So thanks so much, Julia, for your time today.

I’d love to hand it over to you already. And tell us a little bit about what were you doing before in your old life, I guess, and what business are you building now?

Julia Jerg:          Yeah, sure. Thanks for having me, first of all. Yeah, my name is Julia, like Anna just said, and I’m on the beautiful island Ko Pha Ngan in Thailand. And that’s because I have been living the digital nomad lifestyle since 2011, and we are stuck since COVID-19 has struck the world. Luckily we weren’t somewhere not so nice. So that’s the curse of being roaming remote islands.

But yeah, before I started this digital nomad lifestyle, I was actually working in a communications agency back home in Germany. I was running a team of graphic designers, editors, photographers, and just doing a bunch of different things, like organising events and helping our clients to get the communication to their clients set up and also to their employees. So I was in the middle of managing the client’s needs and what my team was supposed to do for them.

And it was a great life. I mean, I was really, literally, having a different day every day. I wasn’t realising that I… Let’s put it this way, I came to a point where my body actually made me stop, because I was working too much and I was not having enough free time.

I actually had two phones. I was working also the weekends, because some of the events happened then. I was not even 30 years old, but I felt like a 50 years manager. Then I said, “Okay, well something has to stop.” I was getting exhausted.

And then a friend of mine, she just came back from taking a sabbatical year from Mexico, and she was like, “Oh my God, that was the best decision ever.” Then it was like this nagging voice in my head that said, “Hmm, what is this? People take breaks from their careers. People go somewhere else. Okay.” Then, just a few weeks later, I was feeling more and more unhappy and I decided to take a break as well.

I told people I would be back after two or three months, because that was the maximum that I wanted to allow myself to be away from my career that I had built up so neatly. I mean, I went to university and afterwards I was doing all those steps that you were supposed to take. I was making good money, so I also thought I needed to just keep on doing that.

Then after I was out there, I realised that there is a life other than the one that I knew, and I learnt different lifestyle models. I saw people who would just go and follow their dreams and build a diving centre somewhere in the middle of the nicest places, where people are like me before only went on a holiday or taking vacations.

And so, slowly but surely, my mindset changed. It’s a long process. I mean, I’m putting this in a nutshell now. But yeah, I discovered my passion for travelling. I discovered my need to breathe and do something different in life.

Then, luckily, former clients from the agency that I used to work for, they reached out to me saying, “Okay, if you’re not coming back, apparently you won’t come back…” After I think six months or so, the first one messaged me saying, “Okay, if you don’t come back, can you then help us from the distance?”

That is when I also discovered something new. I could actually work from anywhere and people would give me a job, I mean. And I could work in my profession, that was even better. Because by the end of the first year of full-time travel, I decided I needed to find a way to make this work, right?

I also fell in love with my partner, who is today the daddy of my two sons. And yeah, that was the last tip that I needed, the last bit that brought me into this mindset, “Okay, I have to make it work out there, because I don’t want to go back.”

Because he’s from Chile, we met in the middle of the desert of Chile, and he was also in travel-mode back then. And we decided to keep travelling together. But obviously my funds were running lower and lower, and I needed to find a way to make money.

I basically did it really the long way. I mean, I didn’t know back then that there was such a thing as digital nomads. When I started, I had no idea how to create an online business or that there’s even such a thing.

And I think it wasn’t such a thing that it is now, today. Like everyone now, if you say, “Oh, I’m trying to create my online business.” “Oh yeah, sure. Me too.” But back then it was like, “Online business? Is that something?” I would say it was fairly new. But still there were resources, and I worked through all of them. I read a lot of blogs.

I started actually with a travel blog. That was the first step into the online world for me back then. And, obviously, since I had a background in marketing and PR, and also at the end of my time working for the agency, they just started doing a little bit of social media marketing for the clients. So I had already an entry-level of all these needs that I now know that they are the basics for creating an online business, right?

But then over the years, I learned a lot about blogging. I created an online presence that today I can look back to. I created an empire around my keywords, so to speak. Digital nomad lifestyle, full-time travel now. Since my kids are here with me, I’m a digital nomad mom. And yeah, I have definitely social proof, created [inaudible 00:07:43]

So when I fast-forward to today, I today help people do the same thing. People come to me when they, A, want to start the digital nomad lifestyle, and they start from zero, they have questions. What do they have to do? What’s the short way, the shortcuts? What are the mistakes that I made, and what are the learnings that I can share with them?

But then there’s also people like entrepreneurs that are already on their path. They have started their online business or their freelancing career. And I help them tweak and look at their businesses from the outside, and help them how to actually optimise it and get more reach and more visibility online. Yeah, now I give you the full story without even stopping.

Anna:               I don’t even need to ask any questions we can end the interview there.

Julia Jerg:          Bye. Well, it was very nice meeting you. Call me.

Anna:               But let me maybe pause there, just because there are so many interesting things there. And I think there are-

Julia Jerg:          Sorry.

Anna:               … so many parallels as well. No, that’s perfect. I do the same when people ask me. I sometimes go back to the story of when I was three years old, so you can go much further back. And when was this, when did you take your two, three months off?

Julia Jerg:          Oh, that was 2011. So, yeah.

Anna:               I mean, we’ve chatted a few times, we did a Clubhouse room together, we did an interview for your podcast, funnily enough. And I’m just smiling because I didn’t know the details of your story.

But it’s so similar to mine, in that I also took three months off. I travelled in South America. I hadn’t heard of this idea, and, as you say, you begin to piece together, “Oh, this is possible.” It was very organic. And I had, of course, a similar marketing background to you as well, and so on. So it’s amusing to me that I meet people all around the world who have such parallel experiences.

But it sounds like, yeah, you were sparked by someone else having been away, and you thought, “Wow, that’s possible.” And then as you said, “Oh wow, there’s remote work. People will pay me to work for them when I’m on the other end of the country, or the other end of the world, even.” And then of course you have the love aspect as well, which adds another dimension too.

Julia Jerg:          Yeah. It was a great [inaudible 00:09:50]

Anna:               Absolutely. Yes, exactly. But of course it is. I mean, whether you have a partner and so on. I mean, we’ve talked about that before, of course, in the context of the children, but has that been a challenge? And I guess before that, because 2011, it’s 10 years now, in fact. You should be celebrating, I guess this should be a big [crosstalk 00:10:06] this year.

Julia Jerg:          Yes. Yes, there will be [crosstalk 00:10:07] In October it marks 10 [inaudible 00:10:09].

Anna:               Wonderful. Oh, amazing.

Julia Jerg:          [crosstalk 00:10:11] be something special

Anna:               If you can cast your way back through the 10 years, I guess, can you think of… I imagine there was some stuff. At the beginning, you didn’t even know that you were sort of setting up a business, you were kind of doing this remote consulting work. And then I guess there have been a few different twists and turns along the way as there always are. So what have been some of the challenges you’ve come up against?

Julia Jerg:          Well, absolutely. I mean, like I said, in the beginning, I also was going against my traditional belief that I could only make money back home. So I sometimes would flip back and think, “Oh, maybe I should take a plane and just go back to Germany and make some money, and then go out travel again.”

Then once I was going through that process, that I don’t need to be in Germany to make money, I would take on client work where I just do… I did a lot of different things like freelance writing. I did take over social media accounts. I would helping with marketing strategies.

I’d say it’s not luck, I mean, but I feel lucky because my network was also bringing me a lot of opportunities and opened up ways to make it work. Friends who would open their own agencies and hired me as a freelancer, or clients that would recommend me to their network. So, it kind of created an ongoing stream of possibilities.

But then I noticed that I was still trading my time for money, and it didn’t really… I mean, it felt different. Of course, it does matter where you are when you work or when you stop working and you open the door, and you are right at the beach.

For me, my happy place is the beach. For others, could be the mountains. But the point is, you can choose where you are, right? And that was always, for me, a motivation.

I say, I have probably worked the same amount of time that I used to when I was back in the agency, but I did it for myself. I look at it as a investment in myself and my personal development. I’ve learned so much, not only about the world, the people out there, the different cultures, the crazy experiences that you can have, but obviously also it was a journey inwards.

And a lot of things that I probably would have never discovered if I was just being put in one place and going the traditional way. So now I forgot, what was the question?

Anna:               No, no, that’s perfect. I just asked what are the challenges, but you are saying [crosstalk 00:13:07] again. It is a bit of luck, but really you had… That’s the advantage of changing career and lifestyle when you’re well into your career, rather than coming straight out of the school.

Because you have the network, you have the skills, you’re in demand. And you have the experience in order to be able to actually create a real business based on those skills, right? So I think that’s a strong position to be in.

One other question is, given that it is 10 years now, and you’ve started… As you said, you were trading time for money, and then you’ve been able to shift your business model.

And I know, apologies, I’ve asked you this before in another setting, but what for you makes a business sustainable? How are you managing to make this lifestyle and this business work for you longer term? Not just, “Oh, hey, I’m going to go off for a year and then come back,” as you said, and earn a normal salary in Germany. But you’re really making it work longer term.

Julia Jerg:          Yeah, of course. I remember you asked me the question, and it was working in my head. Because when we talked about it, and you said for you also sustainability means that you can actually spend time with your family. Which is now, for me, has become priority number one.

I don’t want to sit eight hours locked away in a coworking space, or in our apartments that we rent out when we’re moving around, and then not spending time with my kids. Because that’s actually the beauty of this lifestyle. And that’s what I would call sustainable.

If you can consistently make enough money so that you, A, are able to move whenever you want to, pick the place of where you want to go, and then spend enough quality time with your family. That’s for me enough. I don’t chase any lifetime goals that maybe most people have, cars, houses, or all those material things. It’s really, I mean it might sound like a cliche, but I’m really chasing experiences. I’m happiest when I just have the freedom of choosing.

I’m not saying that we are going to go on like this forever. It could be that we’re settling down somewhere, and might even get a house one day. Who knows? But for now, it’s been great. I just love seeing my kids enjoying their life here.

And especially during times like this, I really appreciate it. I’m grateful every single day that they can roll around in the sand, like little peas. I always look at them, and they’re just happy in the warm sand. And I’m like, “Oh gosh.” I’m really, really just grateful.

I think, just to add on to the point before, it is a portion of luck, but it’s also, I mean, at least 80% of the mindset, and the openness towards being brave and embrace the change. And also don’t be scared to try something new and go against the normal.

Because there are voices and people’s opinions that are coming towards you when you are not doing it the way other people are doing it. That has always been fun for me in a way, because… I don’t know.

Anna:               What have you done? So has it just come naturally to you, you’ve been, “Oh, I don’t care what other people think I’m going to go with what my heart says?” Or have you made sure to surround yourself with like-minded people? Have you worked with a coach yourself to sort of guide you on your choices and business and so on? What have you done to get the help you needed?

Julia Jerg:          You know, funny enough, I’ve never worked with a coach, and I’m now, right now at the stage where I’m deciding to work with a coach for the first time. Just because I’m trying to rebrand my whole business strategy and everything, and I’m looking to get someone to bounce back my ideas that I’m currently working on. And being a coach now for quite a few years, I obviously am convinced about the coaching itself. So I now decided to get a coach for myself.

But no, I’ve always… And I remember moments in my years when I was at school, and my mom telling me stories, obviously, because I can’t really remember them myself, but she said many times teachers would just call her saying, “I tell the entire class, you have to do it this way, and your daughter is always going the other way and she’s doing it the other way.”

And my mom would always ask them, “But is it working anyways? Is it working for her?” They said, “Well, yeah, but it’s not the way we teach the children.” And then she said, “Well, if it works for her, let her do her way,” right?

So I really appreciate my mom also being supportive in that sense, because it is probably one of my unique characteristics. But I wouldn’t say that… I mean, I also care about other people’s opinions, and it has not always been crystal-clear for me.

Like I said, it’s been part of the process also to have those feelings. One day you are 100% convinced. The next day, you feel like, “Oh, I should be not… Go to one place and stay and do the things that other people do.” So I would lie if I said it’s 100% always crystal-clear.

But yeah, I’ve learned to listen to my gut feeling, and I’m also a bit stubborn. So when I like something, I just stick with it.

Anna:               Yeah. But, I mean, honestly, I think I’ve learned that that is one of the biggest drivers for success. Being a bit stubborn, a bit persistent, tenacious, having that grit, right? There will be ups and downs, and building that resilience is something that’s going to be so critical.

I love the story of you being young and doing it your own way and still getting there. Unfortunately it’s the exact opposite for me. I was the good girl who did exactly as I was told. So I’ve had to really break away from that, and it’s been tougher for me to begin to question things. But bizarrely, I feel like I found my way back to the inner child pre-school conditioning and so on. I hope that schools are better now.

I don’t know, in terms of, I guess, world schooling and of course, homeschooling for everybody now with COVID and so on, do you see more possibilities? Are you seeing improvements in the opportunities available, I guess, to teach our children to be more creative and have their own ways of doing things?

Julia Jerg:          I think so. I mean, it could be that I’m really biassed, or conditioned by now my new environment. Because I meet on a constant basis, people that are in the same mindset. Especially here now on this island, but also before, we usually go to places where we know where we meet travel families or families that are like us, digital nomad families.

So when we have conversations, we are not discussing, “Should my child go to school or not?” No, it’s the other way. “What are we going to do to make this educational process the most effective, fun, and best for our children.”

For me now, it looks like… But again, just because I’m in this bubble of the digital nomads and alternative families. So for me, it looks like there is a big movement and a great awareness of people that something has to change. And yeah, I mean, the fact that COVID has happened and is currently messing with everyone’s schedules.

People are more and more, not only in the family and the educational sector, but also obviously it’s revolutionising the way people are working and thinking about their jobs. Because before we were told we are the crazy ones, because we don’t have the nine-to-fives that are really secure and safe. And now everyone’s lost their jobs, and trying to become more independent from a certain employer.

I think, yeah, 2020 was clearly a year of shifting, I think. Shifting of consciousness. I feel many people are open towards new topics and ways. And I hope this is going to be changing the world for the better.

Anna:               I hope so too. Both for individuals, I think… Of course, it’s been super tough for so many people with homeschooling, with mental health, all these things, and not to mention the physical health of COVID, and so on.

But I think the individuals have seen another world. A little bit like you and I when we travelled, we realised there was another lifestyle that was possible, and suddenly, “Hang on. I don’t have to sit in the car every morning and evening driving to and from the office.”

Someone I was interviewing last time was saying, “Look, I don’t need to fly up to, or take the train up to Manchester for a half hour meeting. We can do that virtually.”

And likewise for the company, they begin to realise that, “Hey, we can let go of control a little bit. We can trust our employees and so on.” So, I hope and agree with you that there is a shift more broadly, that more people will wake up to this kind of flexible working.

And of course I’m really deep in it too, so I feel like, of course, everyone I work with is sort of in that mindset too. But I do think it’s spreading more to the normality, I suppose, if we can call it that.

I have to ask sort of a very logistical question. But when I was travelling a lot, I always had the experience that, when I was at home, I had all this stuff and I needed all of it, right? The perfect makeup and the handbags and whatever.

Then as soon as I was away, I was like, “Oh, I can live out of a rucksack and it’s fine.” But now, again, we’re actually in the process of moving with two kids and I’m just… The amount of stuff. And it’s not stuff we’ve even bought. It’s gifts, it’s charity stuff. I’m not so worried about us having bought things, but it’s just the amount of things.

So how do you manage that when you travel? I guess a selfish tip for me. But in general, how is it even feasible to travel with young kids and to make do?

Julia Jerg:          Yeah, well, this is one of the questions that I get on a frequent basis, because people always think you need a lot of stuff. But it’s also just a mindset thing.

To be honest, we flew to Thailand from Europe a bit over a year ago when we thought we were only here for two months. And then I had a conference lined up after the two months here in Thailand. So we said, “We’re just going to fly hand luggage,” right? That’s all. Carry-on.

And actually that’s not even entirely true, because before we even hopped on the plane to Thailand, we decided, I made a… I should go scroll back in my Instagram feed. Because I was actually announcing it, after I don’t know how many years of travelling with a huge backpack, and always my partner, he was complaining because he was the one carrying it.

I have to admit, you use maybe one-third of the things that you carry with you. So I announced it and said, “From now on, we’re only flying hand luggage.” And it’s such a deliberate, or how do you say?

Anna:               Liberating, yeah.

Julia Jerg:          Liberating, yes. And every time you get to a new place, there are shops. If something’s missing, you just buy it. So, big learning. You don’t have to travel with a huge bag of diapers. There are shops where you can buy them when you get there. I mean, get a few for the road, and then you’re good.

And also clothes. I mean, especially if you’ve travelled to countries where it’s hot and humid, don’t take too much clothes with you, too many things that are just taking up room.

But now I have to also say that after over a year here on the island, we’ve moved around on the island and changed houses quite a bit, but we’ve also gathered a lot of stuff. So last time we moved, that’s actually a week ago, we came to a new place here, and a friend of ours, she helped us moving. And she said, “You guys, how did you do that? You came in with hand luggage. Now, look at you.”

She even had to lend us those huge suitcases where we put our stuff in, and I was like, “Hey, like you, it’s a lot of gifts.” A lot of people who left the island or who just passing by and say, “Oh, you have kids, here. There’s toys.” And I’m like, “Oh, I can’t deal with more toys,” but my kids obviously can. So that’s how we collected a lot of the stuff, but usually you don’t need it.

Anna:               You don’t need it. Yeah. Again, I look around, I’m surrounded by books and even paper. This is my study, and it’s still, just in this room, there’s so many things. But I think, yeah, I’ll go back to the Marie Kondo approach again and see if I can… I’ve been doing lots of eBay and getting rid of lots of stuff, so hopefully I can… And I know what you mean. It feels amazing, doesn’t it, when you don’t have it-

Julia Jerg:          It does.

Anna:               … and you realise you don’t need it. So I think it’s, again, the shifting the mindset and the perception of what’s required and what’s… Yeah.

And of course, being able to pass it onto someone else, because what we don’t want to do is just throw it away. That’s always, then you feel [crosstalk 00:26:52] guilty that you’ve got it. Yeah.

Then I guess just financially, would be the last question to ask. Because I did have a really interesting interview with Jeremy Beament last month, around the difference between sort of a wealth creation, growth, “I’m going to create a business and I’m going to be an entrepreneur and the CEO and build an empire,” kind of approach. Versus, “Actually, I don’t want to burn out. I want to have more time with my family. I want to be a digital nomad.”

It sounds like you made a very conscious choice to have the lifestyle kind of business. I guess, without having to share any numbers or anything, but how long did it take you to get it to be financially viable for you?

And are you ever tempted to go off and build, like, “Oh, I’m going to have an office, and I’m going to have a team, and make it this…” The ambitions sort of run away with you. Or are you really happy within, “Yes, I’m successful. I have enough to live the life I want to live and that’s my goal.”

Julia Jerg:          I have always loved to work. So for me, I’m guilty for being a workaholic, even though I’m capable of consciously deciding against working too much. But there’s always, yeah, this approach of, “How can I take another idea that could turn into a new passion project.”

But again, as long as I don’t feel like it’s work, I feel it’s okay. And as long as I don’t lose my priorities, I find it’s also okay. But it’s not because I want to have a pile of dollar bills laying around. Just because I’m also entertained by working and connecting with other people. I love that.

Yeah, so I’d say it took me a while, I guess four or five years, actually, to get to that stage where I say, “I want to now translate everything that I’ve learned in the agency, and then also from this freelancing, and being now the service provider.”

Because before I was always hiring those freelancers for my agency back then, and then I was in this position where I was knocking on doors, or where people said, “Can you work for us?” And I was like, “Okay.” So now I want to go back again and be the business owner and be on top of things, and decide a little bit more, A, about my time, the project that I’m choosing.

And also having, yeah… How to say? I also like the risk of, you’re in charge, and you’re full responsibility. It’s a little bit like investing at the stock market. I guess you have to also be the type of person for this.

But yeah, I’d say ever since I started that, and I created my own coaching business and everything that’s related to it. I don’t say this is the end of my career, or the final stage, but it’s one next step. [crosstalk 00:30:19]

Anna:               Hmm, I’m sure it will evolve again, right? We’re still young, and I’m sure the economic situation will evolve, and you’ll have other ideas and things will shift and so [crosstalk 00:30:27].

Julia Jerg:          Yeah. Always. Too many ideas.

Anna:               Yeah. And the fact that you enjoy the work and so on, as long as you enjoy it, then absolutely. What advice would you give to someone, I guess is the final question then. In terms of, maybe they know they’ve bought into this life and they’re already trying to make it work, and they’re feeling a bit like, “Ah, it’s not quite working.”

If there’s something, that you can lend them some of your stubbornness and grit to keep going. Or any other advice you’d like to give someone who loves the sound of what you’ve created in your life.

Julia Jerg:          Yeah, I mean, embrace the fact that it is a process, and it’s a learning journey, and everyone has to find their individual story and create it. That’s the beauty of it. You can create it the way that suits you best.

So I can give you all the experiences, and share all the advice that I have gathered and that has worked for me. But then you still have to do the work for yourself and apply it and translate it to your life and individual needs and situation.

But for me, I started my podcast, The Digital Nomad Mom podcast, just to get the message out and to inspire others, and say, “Try it at least once in your life.” You know, you can always go back. Your old life will always be there and wait for you. And if you don’t know how to do it, then you can read e-books, you can take online courses, you can go with a coach. You have so many opportunities nowadays to make it work. But then put in 100% and try it.

I mean, also it’s not going to work from one day to the next, like with any other business. Look at it at least, I’d say, six months. If you really put in the effort and everything, like 100% dedication, six months is a realistic timeframe where you can say, “Okay, if I don’t see any results, nothing.” So no income, no connection that could lead potentially to something, then I’d say, “Okay, maybe it’s not for you. Maybe you should go reevaluate your situation.”

But I doubt it. I mean, if you’re really passionate about this, and if you really taste it, right? Then I’d say you can make it work. Three to six months, something is going to happen and changing in your life.

And of course, I should say, if you are in the position to becoming financially sustainable first, don’t start travelling. Even though I know people who had 300 US dollars in their account, bought a one way ticket and made it happen too. It’s possible, but it’s crazy. And it’s maybe the difficult way to do it.

So have some financial backup there, because in case you don’t generate anything, yeah, you should be able to come back and have some sort of safety net there. That’s the ideal way. But then, like I said, there’s so many stories that show that it’s possible either way.

Anna:               Yeah. And there’s so many nuggets there. I think, as you said, it is your definition of success, as I call it, in terms of what you want. Because we can all share our experiences, but ultimately you have to decide what you want to do. You have to decide what risk level you’re willing to take on.

And, as you’ve said, I know lots of people who have headed off into the sunset and made it work somehow. It’s taken much longer, perhaps, or they’ve been lucky. Or as you said, actually, clients go, “Oh, actually Julia’s not coming back, so we’d better pay her.” Could be you’re forcing your clients to make it work for you, right? But they could also say, “No, we’re going to work with somebody else.” So there’s so many options here.

But I think the most important thing is that the how can get figured out, right? So, as you said, just commit to it. Decide. “I’m going to do this for six months.” “I’m going to try and do this for a year.” And I’m sure, exactly as you said, it’s very unlikely, I could pretty much guarantee that you will have some kind of result, and you’ll get bitten by the bug and want to keep going, right? Then one opportunity leads to another and so on.

So it always takes longer than we think, but worst case, you’ve had a beautiful year off and you can come back to another interesting job. But yes [inaudible 00:34:48]

Julia Jerg:          Maybe we should design a label that says, Warning. This could become addictive, or something. It could really change your life. Are you ready for this?

Anna:               Well, but I say, it’s funny isn’t it, because you look… I think I wrote an article soon after I’d left my job about the sort of… I said, “You’re looking out on the world of uncertainty, and no money, and so on. And you’re in this position, you think you’re all safe and secure, and so on.”

But actually, as we’ve just said, thanks to COVID, but also thanks to a number of different factors, we’re not that safe in that job. And once you’re outside, you have a totally different perspective and view of everything.

Suddenly it’s 100% possibilities, and it doesn’t feel risky anymore. Because you meet other people doing the same thing, you get opportunities and you’re just on such a different level. You’re just looking at things from different way.

So it is that initial leap that’s so tough, but then also, unfortunately, it is that’s persistence and grit, and so on, after you’ve left the initial peak of enthusiasm. I think being stubborn and having some of the personality traits that you’ve outlined can really help you. But then working with somebody, finding other people doing similar things, will really help as well.

Julia Jerg:          Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, or just, if you grab on someone who’s a leading role model in this field, and you can just aim towards their goals and chase it after, that also helps a lot. If someone can inspire you, if there’s someone out there, that could be one way to do it. Just copy their system and follow along. You don’t have to invent [crosstalk 00:36:24]

Anna:               [crosstalk 00:36:25] great way to start, right? No, you don’t have to invent it. And by now, so many people have done so many different things that there’s bound to be someone who’s done more or less, and you can start, and then you can go off on your own path off that if you’d like.

Julia Jerg:          Exactly.

Anna:               Yeah, absolutely. Okay.

Julia Jerg:          Yup.

Anna:               So Julia, thank you so much for sharing. Again, I’m quite amused, and not surprised, that we share so many parallels there in our story. Congratulations on your 10 years, looking forward to the celebration in October.

Julia Jerg:          Thank you.

Anna:               And I hope you can travel again very, very soon. But I’m glad to hear that you’ve been enjoying your time in Thailand in the meantime. Where can people find… So, I’ll of course link to your podcast, but if you could tell us again, where can we find out more about you? Your website, your favourite social channel and [crosstalk 00:37:02] find you.

Julia Jerg:          Sure. Sure. So my website is jeyjetter.com. And on social media, you can find me on all the possible platforms with Jey Jetter. But then on Clubhouse, you’ll find me with my first name and last name.

I’ve discovered a new love with Clubhouse, and, yeah, I’d love to connect with other people. Because I find it a really cool way to connect with others.

Anna:               Absolutely. No, we’ll put that in the link as well. It’s been a great place to meet with people and, yeah, a different level of connection and fun. It’ll be interesting to see where that goes, I guess too after COVID, if it continues or if it’s…

I did see that Twitter has started doing spaces, and I’m sure, as ever, the big giants are going to be copying the platform. But they have had a year now to get off the ground, I guess. So, yeah, we’ll see. It’ll be interesting. But I’m glad you’re having fun there, and [inaudible 00:37:59] your next room when you’re there, and likewise for me too.

So thanks so much, Julia. I’ve really enjoyed [inaudible 00:38:03] with you over the last few weeks and I look forward to staying in touch with you too.

Julia Jerg:          Yeah, thanks so much for having me.

Anna:               Perfect. Thank you.

Julia Jerg:          Okay, cool.

 

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